Curiosity Studio: Lauren Callis

In this episode of Not So Small, hosts Sam Bauman and Adam Rondeau visit Lauren at Curiosity Studio, a community art studio on East Lake Street in Minneapolis.

After moving to Minnesota Lauren noticed a lack of accessible community spaces that use art for wellness and self-understanding, and from that observation Curiosity Studio was born. The studio focuses on process over product, helping people overcome intimidation around art-making by emphasizing practice and curiosity rather than perfection.

Lauren also discusses the challenge many artists face with the "business owner" identity, explaining her preference for thinking of herself as someone who holds the key to a community space while making necessary business decisions.

The episode highlights how Lauren balances intentionality with openness, providing conceptual guidelines while allowing the community to shape how the space is used. Her approach demonstrates an alternative model for running a values-driven business that prioritizes accessibility and authentic human connection over traditional metrics of success.

Guest Info

• Business: Curiosity Studio
• Guest: Lauren Callis (she/her)
• Links: Website • Instagram

Community Shoutout

• Z Puppets Rosenschnoz (Website • Instagram)

Host & Show Info

• Host Name: Sam Bauman (she/her)
• About the Host: Sam is the President of Mellowlark Labs, a Twin Cities-based small business consulting agency. She has a masters degree in counseling psychology, a field she worked in for several years before applying her skills in business, and is certified in Organization Development.

Podcast Website

Sound Editing By: Adam Rondeau
Podcast Art By: Andy Bauman (website)

Transcript

Sam Bauman: 0:10

Hey everyone, I'm Sam Bauman.

Adam Rondeau: 0:11

And I'm Adam Rondeau.

Sam Bauman: 0:13

And we're the hosts of not so Small, the podcast where we ask small businesses the big questions. Today we're talking with Lauren, owner of Curiosity Studio, a community art studio in Minneapolis. Although Lauren is technically the owner of Curiosity Studio, she says she thinks of herself as more of a key holder. And that distinction says everything about how she approaches running her business. Lauren has a background in art therapy and she's created something that is part community center, part creative workshop, and part safe haven for anyone who's ever felt intimidated by the art world. In our conversation, we talk about why she prioritizes process over product and her philosophy that all humans are naturally creative beings and we just need the right space to rediscover that part of ourselves. Lauren has such a thoughtful approach to run a values driven business. Hope you enjoy our conversation.

Lauren Callis: 1:17

My name is Lauren and we are at Curiosity Studio.

Sam Bauman: 1:21

And what is Curiosity Studio?

Lauren Callis: 1:23

Curiosity Studio is an art studio on Eastlake street and we are dedicated to know yourself as well as others through the process of making awesome.

Sam Bauman: 1:38

So thinking back to when you made the decision to start this business tell me about what got you to that point and what the problem was that you were trying to solve with Curiosity Studio.

Lauren Callis: 1:51

Curiosity Studio was born out of a desire to make a space that was community focused, that used art as a tool for wellness and understanding yourself and exploring creative processes outside of maybe a more formal setting, as well as the community component being available to people for their emotional needs and how we don't have many spaces that we can access that. I have a background in art therapy and I did a lot of my studies and my initial practice as a within community settings. And so I would show up in spaces that weren't maybe traditional clinical spots and see a variety of ways that people were using art as a way to whether it was therapeutically or just a way of practicing well being. And I really loved that and felt aligned with that because I use art in that similar fashion for myself. And so as time went on, I moved to Minnesota and I was looking for spaces that could do a similar thing and I wasn't finding many. And so it was something I kept in the back of my mind and then later on was able to sort of attempt to solve that problem, or at least I hope we solve that problem.

Sam Bauman: 3:14

So what are some of the ways that your art studio brings sort of the wellness and the emotional component into the activities that you organize.

Lauren Callis: 3:25

I think a lot of our instructors come at it a variety of ways. So perhaps the hope is that people feel comfortable coming in. That I think is a first step. Sometimes art studios have a sense of, you know, I have to be capital A artist before I go. And that's not an expectation nor is it even desired. Here you can be whoever you are and that might mean you're budding in your creative endeavors or you're very comfortable in your creative endeavors. And I don't feel I've seen a lot of spaces that feels good for both parties, or at least it feels fluid for both parties. So that was an initial goal and I wanted to make sure that stayed true. Depending on the offering moving forward, I think it's evolved to be, you know, sometimes a certain medium someone will use is more somatic. So you know, you're kind of tapping into the sensory motor skills that the medium requires. So if I'm stimulating stitching, what is that therapeutic experience or that benefit that I'm receiving from the in and out of the needle and the thread? And we can make meaning from those sort of sensory motor processes. And that can be a very validating part of the experience for some participants. And then honestly, I think one of the greatest outcomes of the space that I hear a lot from participants is this third space. And so, you know, it's not their home, it's not their work. It's a place that they can go and have extended conversations or just be and not have any conversation with someone, or perhaps they just have someone that knows their name. And that benefit that we've lost with a lot of the closure of third spaces or just less opportunity to plug in. So we try to access a third space. Because sometimes third spaces can be very expensive. So that's a goal as well. Let's see. I think one of the hopes that I have for the space is that people also can take some ownership of it or feel that they have a place here that they can carve out for themselves. I see that in a lot of different participants experience and the way they describe it. And that's a huge outcome for me. I think, you know, I call myself a key holder far more than I Call myself like a business owner. And so I hold keys, obviously, and that requires a certain amount of management or decision making. But it feels a little bit easier to be.

Adam Rondeau: 6:10

Yeah. Wow. I mean, a lot of the values that you're talking about are. Feel more rare than I'd like for them to be in our world. Those develop when you were doing so before you came to Minnesota, you were in Chicago, is that right? Did that come from some of the experiences that you had there? Working in spaces where there were, like, more. Where there was more community or where did. Where do you think your values came from? When you're talking about things like just being a key holder instead of a business owner, and you're talking about. You're thinking through things like how do we make sure this is accessible to afford it? You know, those don't come out of thin air. Right. So I'd be curious to hear you reflect on where some of that has come from.

Lauren Callis: 6:57

Sure. Well, I can certainly reflect. I think sometimes it's evolving, and that is a phase that perhaps I'm at now. But initially the values certainly were part of the training. Art therapy is, I think, something that we all have the potential to experience. And so it can get a little convoluted if you want to, you know. So for the purpose of this conversation, I think I'll consider it from this, like, broader community framework. People are innately creative, and so how can we create space without kind of adding this additional expectation on top? And, you know, that's an interesting needle to come in and have a very clear expectation. And sometimes it's creating space, sometimes it's leading with an opportunity, sometimes it's a little bit of both. And so. Or, excuse me, leading with, like, a prompt. And so I think I just observed in my studies that there is such a spectrum of creative expression. And, you know, anytime you're training to make you think about the ethics of everything you do. And so that perhaps is the. The sort of devil one shoulder and the angel on the other. So that certainly started that values journey. And then I think values generally are the backbone of a lot of small businesses. Right. Like, I think the mission of a small business gets to scale into these, like, monster Corporations or companies. And so I am so proud of our values because I think the values allow us to have some influence on that. And then also if we're not aligned with our values, my hope is that people are able to kind of ask more or get more context on where our decisions have changed or how things have looked. And I think a lot of my values come out of me identifying far more as an artist than I do, perhaps the business owner, key holder, or just even the art therapist. Sometimes I think, you know, no one's coming in here assuming that they're getting art therapy. That's like, we're sort of, you know, that's. That's. If you're coming into my classes, perhaps you're. You're. Oh, that's an interesting take. Or you're suspicious of some of the questions or something. But I don't think anyone knows that's kind of what we're coming in with. But. Yeah, yeah, I'm. I think you had. I had multiple thoughts that started there as I was going.

Adam Rondeau: 9:35

I didn't. I sort of asked a rambling question, so I don't blame you.

Lauren Callis: 9:38

Yeah, no, it's good. I. I enjoy thinking about the values of a business because I think it often is a really easy way to. To understand where some of their actions are coming from and where their decisions are, why they're being made.

Adam Rondeau: 9:52

Yeah.

Sam Bauman: 9:53

Something that you said a minute ago really struck me that humans are innately creative beings. And you also talked about the meaning that can be gathered or pulled out of even an act as simple as sewing with the needle and thread. Can you tell me a little bit more about where art comes from and what that does mean to human beings?

Lauren Callis: 10:16

Well, let's go back to art making processes. Whether that was these processes as it results in garments to be made for aspects of your survival. So I think we can, like, really get deep in the history of where people are, why people are creating, where people are creating. I love talking about that. Perhaps the part that I'm most interested in is how disconnected and what I hope this space also really allows for people is how disconnected we've gotten from our bodies in this. Whether it's the digital age or sort of the pace of work, work, and all these sort of like, keeping up with the Jones's mentality that has moved us away from doing something for the Sake of doing it versus doing something that we enjoy and find value and pleasure in. And so I was initially drawn to make that emotional expression available for purchase. And I don't have any judgment to those that choose that. It just was my line that I kind of discovered pretty early on. And I've changed that as time goes on in some ways. But for the most part, it stemmed from this desire to an income, but not through the artwork itself. And so I understood there was many paths to that, whether it was education or teaching people about art. And so I've loved this balance that Curiosity Studio has allowed me to do of being both this facilitator of, you know, experiences and space. And I really align as an artist with this social practice model of how can we create these. These sort of containers through experiences that allow people to be more in touch with themselves or others vis art making. Or maybe it's just the conversations that flow and all these various things that happen when you get a bunch of people in the room. And then my own creative practice is so informed by what I do here because I love the technical still and I love understanding sort of the process that leads to a product. But I find we don't focus as much here on the product because sometimes that leads to these barriers that often lead people away from art making if it's not their, again, capital a artist identity. And so my hope is that we're very disarming approach to tap into that innate creative energy that they are maybe experiencing when they're cooking dinner or even just like the way some people make a bed. I'm like, wow, that was beautiful. You know, it's like, what are these processes that we do that allow us to express ourselves? And that is always going to me. And so I've seen it in a million ways with all the people that I've worked with in my life. But I also think there's a million more ways to see it. And so hopefully the space allows for people to sort of try on different versions of that.

Sam Bauman: 13:38

Well, when it comes to give it a try. Right. And I know that you do a lot of programs here, but you also do programs out in the community. So can you tell me a little bit more about what those are and kind of what your audience is in those spaces?

Lauren Callis: 13:57

Yeah. So at the studio, I'd say we get a smattering of folks from the neighborhood or folks from. They saw us on the website and they really want to learn a specific technique that we're offering at that time. And they come in. And so we get a wide range of people that come to the space. They're pretty bought in, I'd say if they come to the space, they're aware of sort of our deal. And that's always exciting. And then when we have found success in the community, it's because we're meeting people where they're at and finding their communities, you know, understanding of art and tapping into that versus creating an expectation or, you know, having our sort of agenda. And so, you know, an example of that is we've tried at the studio many years to do summer camps, and we have a very small space that's fairly intentional, also affordable. And the ability to run camps was just. It's baked into my DNA. Like, I've worked in camps and I love camps. And so I was. I thought it was a sure success. And then it dawned on me, after a few years of just really terrible attendance with the camps that we offered, like, oh, all of these kids, for the most part have siblings, and those siblings are in a different age bracket than we're offering this camp for. And so maybe we should just go where those siblings are also able to. To do their camp at the same time as we're doing our camp. And so we found partnership with some of the community ed camps that are offered in the neighborhood. So, you know, it's a little bit of the riddling of where are the people and do they want us to be there, and if we're there, does it make more sense for our programming? And so we can do that checklist. But then other times, there's a group that, you know, we do many programs. We have staff that are at the Martin Luther Care facilities. Those are various care facilities around the metro area that have a spectrum of support that's offered depending on the setting, and primarily working with older adults and using the creative process as a way to week. And so that's beautiful too. You know, we're able to leave the site because that would just be too much of a. A task. And so that sometimes is the way that we strike a balance. And I'd say we also find a lot of opportunity in, you know, maybe more of a specific neighborhood event or a block party or a way that we can kind of pop up and be very entry level art experience or, you know, entry level exposure to. Oh, I never even knew that you could make sculpture out of tinfoil and tape. And that is exciting to me. And now I can go home and I can do that. And I didn't even know you're from Curiosity Studio. And I'm never gonna walk by your space ever, because you're in Golden Valley today or something. But it's been a lovely way to their community.

Sam Bauman: 17:05

And yeah, you're here in your space in the community, but going out into the community is another way to, I think, really embody the values that you have.

Lauren Callis: 17:16

Yeah. And then there's some times where we say no. Cause we're like, we're not maybe the person for that, or we're not the. That's not our community. And we don't know enough about that community to be, you know, present at that offering. Or we'll find another person that can connect there. So it's again, back to the values of like, who. Who are we? And what do we have that can serve this community? Community. And is it a facilitator that's going to go, or is it, you know, a little handout that we have that's there instead? Or what is needed to make sure that we're connecting with people the best way we can.

Sam Bauman: 17:53

Tell me about a risk that you've taken in starting or running your business and what you learned from that.

Lauren Callis: 18:01

My first thought is, I started this business.

Sam Bauman: 18:03

That's honestly a pretty common answer. That's totally okay.

Lauren Callis: 18:07

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it's very. It's a hard time for arts organizations, and finding ways to. It feels like a risk. Anytime I challenge the assumption of what the value of art is and the art experience, it feels like a risk because often that means we might lose the job or we might not have the reception that we hoped for by that partner. Sometimes it is just the education is so time consuming. Right. Like, it's. I don't have time to educate someone on why this is valuable, so I'll just kind of simplify it. And if they take it. And if they don't. Yeah.

Adam Rondeau: 18:56

Where do you find yourself having to, like, assert that value of Art, like, where. In what situations are you finding yourself having to convince people of that value?

Lauren Callis: 19:09

It's interesting when you get an ask to participate in an event. Let's say we're just, you know, let's talk about a arbitrary block party, right? And there's something I'm really grateful for, which is this greater understanding of, like, oh, arts is nice to have when families are present or when, you know, we have this general milieu that needs some, like, you know, focused energy. How can we do an activity or something that offers people some form of some outlet? And I love those interests, and I think sometimes there's perhaps a lack of understanding of what that would require. So even how many times we've attended events where I make sure we have a sink or I make sure we have some of these basic things, if we're doing something more interactive and messy, and we try to the DJ booths because were the fun part, right? So then the DJs the fun part, and we then get aligned with the dj and we're, like, shouting, and we're telling people that it's so cool to express yourself. Shouting. So I think there's these broader, like, milieu considerations that we do really well. And I think I'm very proud of the way that we've sort of created this list of factors that impact not only the experience that customers have, but our staff. And, like, when people are working, an event like that is exhausting. And how can we perhaps just add a little context to meet and greet people for four hours? Or how do we add a little bit of context and clarity around? Yeah, you're gonna need a sink when you're making art. And it might not be about the mess of it, but you're just gonna need to, like, do some maintenance on the tools and the materials and offering people some really beautiful experiences, but not, you know, removing the parts that make those run, I think is a thing that my hope for. You know, back to solve? I was an artist in the community, doing tons of community events without a ton of people advocating for me. And so I learned a lot from that. My. You'd have to ask them. But I hope the people that work for me feel I do some of that middleman work to the arts. And so I think it's a lot of that stuff too, that gets in the way of providing the experience that we want. But there's all these factors to consider and it can get challenging.

Sam Bauman: 21:58

I'm hearing kind of two things. One is like, just not understanding the logistics and the work and the resources that go into creating a creative experience. But then there's also like, you know, in your example with the DJ booth, really fundamentally not understanding what makes that experience special. Right. Like the ability to making it as meaningful as it can be. And so if you have loud music playing right next door, you're not really getting that opportunity. And people maybe don't understand that.

Lauren Callis: 22:35

Yeah. And we live in a society fundamentally built on exchanges of products or things. And people that are organizing an event for better and for worse, wanna make sure that people have a great time and they have something to take away from it. And when we sort of live within our values, we're very focused on the process far more than we are the product. And again, that doesn't mean we're like, the product doesn't matter. The product is a huge place of pride and joy and expression and technique that you've mastered and you've worked really hard to develop a skill and look at it in this real time. And it is not without all of this beautiful process based experience and benefit as well. And so talking to be really valuable. You might not have anybody leaving with the small item that then displays that process was valuable. And so there's a lot of risk sometimes in living within our values, within the kind of idea of us bringing a process based experience and trusting that there's going to be some benefit there. And people don't always have that benefit and they don't experience it. Like, you know, sometimes people come and they walk up to your table and they're like, absolutely not. And they walk away. And it's different than when we have experiences in the space where we have so many things that we're telling people before they come. We're like, you can prepare for this or you can prepare for that, and we can kind of control that narrative a little bit. So they feel settled when they come into the space. So when we're just coming cold into a community and we're doing art making, there's going to art making. Experiences. They had a teacher that told them they didn't know how to do something, or they had a really negative piece of feedback that was shared when they were at this pivotal age. And so there's tons of things that allow people to move away from the arts. And my hope is that we're always creating space to think about something else you like very, you know, specifically or in a new way. And so I'm attracted to that type of work, too. How do we just plant a seed? And planting a seed isn't always the most financially exciting, you know, bet for some partners. But we've had countless outcomes, so I like to talk about those.

Sam Bauman: 25:08

Well, what you said about emphasizing process really resonates with me. I mean, I think that in our work, we're always talking about how the process is really what's important. And it can be challenging to sort of, like, make that connection for them.

Lauren Callis: 25:35

Yeah, it's a hard circle to square. You know, it's. It's easy to feel a little woo about it, too, you know, and then, like, we have very tangible outcomes that we can name, like, oh, you came in. And perhaps this is sort of therapy considerations that come in for me sometimes of, like, you came in and took 10 minutes to feel settled the first time, and then the next time you came, you felt settled within five minutes of being here. And we're not measuring those things with people, but as much as we can, we're naming what might be happening and how that might feel and supporting people with however they're experiencing that.

Adam Rondeau: 26:15

Yeah. And earlier you mentioned when, you know, you're getting out in the community, how oftentimes the conversation will feel more open when they're thinking about the kids that will be at the events. And I think that's, like. It's interesting when I think about. I spent a lot of time thinking about this, at least in my own social circle, where, like, adults stop learning how to be kids. And that's, like, hardly a new idea. I know, but I'd be curious to, like, connect more and more with art. And there is a general movement where people are doing more of that as adults. But, you know, I assume that's sometimes maybe, and especially a rewarding space to find yourself in when that person's coming in. 10 minutes to settle in. Now they're leaving with, like, the sort of release having been experienced because they just sat there and did something with their hands. I'm, you know, what do you. It's sort of a big question, I guess, but, you know, what are the things that get in the way of adults feeling comfortable in, like, settling into those spaces?

Lauren Callis: 27:33

Yeah. Your question touches on a thing. A few things I think about a lot, which is this permission to make something or the permission that we sometimes I feel, are offering people just by being here. And we're a bit colorful. It can feel maybe uncomfortable even just to have it feel so saturated in its colors for some people, because that automatically. We've been trained to visually read that as children's experiences if it's these saturated rainbow colors.

Sam Bauman: 28:07

Right.

Lauren Callis: 28:08

And I'm teasing a little bit, but I do think people read us as a child place pretty quickly. So to what you're expressing, I think permission is a huge part that I feel we offer. Sometimes even just breaking down the materials that are available is a really crucial step to people feeling comfortable. Because we live in a world where we think we should know something. Why don't I know this? And we're constantly having to know everything. We are humans that live just this one life. We don't know everything, and we can't know everything. And so I hope in all of the experiences that are offered here, we are really emphasizing, like, this is an X acto knife. Here's the best method to use an X acto knife. Or this is the mat that goes with the X acto knife. Or this is the way you might find more success with this type of material. And slowing it down is a huge part of the experience. I mean, I had someone call the other day, and this is a very sweet request, but they were. They were trying to buy their paints. And they were asking some really kind of basic fundamentals of, like, building this piece of art. And they just really had the product in mind. They were like, I have the painting in mind. And. And I wanted to make and then they were talking about the variety of paintbrushes and the variety of paints and all of these things. And you go into a store and it's endless. And so perhaps what we do really well is the experiences we offer are pretty fundamental instead of these, know, additional little rabbit holes you can go into that are endless with art making. And I think that's okay because I think a lot of our people come in and say, yeah, I didn't know that this was what this tool was for. That's great. Now I know. And we've. We try to build some fundamental language. And then I. One of the offerings that we have that I think is really lovely. I'm going back a little bit, is open studio. It's every month, there's. There's three of them. They're always free. For the most part, we're making art based on a theme instead of within a specific technical or material category. And theme might be. I did one about a poem that I read within the month of teaching it, and I was like, oh, that's a really beautiful poem, and I would love to make some art around it. And so I just wanted to. And so I brought the poem, and we read the poem. And then everyone gets to respond in a variety of ways. And I, in my training, found a lovely relationship with an art therapist who talked about setting the table. And so we think about that a lot when it comes to access what you're looking for? And so we. The table was set and people were able to grab what they needed. They were able to. They could just do their own thing. But I bring that up because we had a feedback session not too long ago where some people were sharing about their experiences on open studios just so we could know that the program was working and effective. And someone shared how those chances just to come regularly for two hours and explore the space sparked interest in another medium that they knew we offered. And so eventually they got comfortable enough to come and take that class. Or. Or they thought it was valid to spend the amount of money that it was. Or, you know, there's just these scaffolding, these levels of scaffolding that I feel we have baked into the formatting of our programming. So, like, how do you feel? What's getting in the way when you're first starting? Okay, we'll start with that and we'll make this space available in that way, what's the experience at the next level that you might be having and then going from there? And we might not be able to ensure that those barriers are at least in the conversation, because sometimes the barrier is the barrier. We're not going to solve that problem. It is about looking at the problem and knowing it's there and getting creative around it. That can sometimes be the experience of making art. Like limitations are one of my favorite tools in art making. So for me, that's exciting. For others, that's going to be terrifying. And so at the very least, we've created these levels of scaffolding to build slowly into their comfort. And then some people are like, no, I'm good. I'll just take this class and I'll be out and I'll go do that in my own studio and practice that for the rest of my life.

Sam Bauman: 33:05

Can you share a success story that you have had with bringing art to. To a person who maybe was feeling hesitant about it or a program that went really well? Just a moment that really sticks out to you.

Lauren Callis: 33:21

This feedback session that we recently had was so meaningful to me. Again, to the point of product versus process, sales, or commerce, it's not always clear, even when you are offering it, what's working. And so we try to review what's offered and make sure people are responding in the way that we're intending. And if it's not, then how can we make some changes? Or is that possible at this time? And some people that shared at this space had come multiple times and they'd said how it took them a number of times to feel comfortable. It took them a number of times to know where some materials were. And now they get to have that experience of welcoming other people in. And the facilitator isn't expected to be the primary point of contact for someone in the space. It might be a person that looks like they've been there a few times. And hearing that comfort was a big deal for me because the comfort is. Is earned. You know, we're not expecting people to come in here and trust us right away. Trust is a built experience. And when we're asking people to me. So it's a huge honor when people come back. It's. I mean, it's huge honor people come at all. And then when people choose to come back and share that excitement with someone else. And it. It was incredibly special for me just to hear that it was working and it worked in the way that we intended. And that's a lot of hands that are involved in that program. They took a class from multiple instructors, and all of those people, and specifically this person, I had never been in the room, and so that was exciting for me to be like, oh, yeah, that's so great. All of these people that taught you really created a meaningful experience for you. And it makes me just really pleased that people are taking a chance on it.

Sam Bauman: 35:29

Yeah, that's definitely a testament to the team that you've built here too. If you're seeing your values really consistently played out, you know, even when you're not there, that's gotta be a really good feeling.

Lauren Callis: 35:42

It's special to gather, and you don't always know what it's gonna look like. You don't always know what people think it is. And I think that's the other risk. I mean, I'm stuck on the risk question mainly because, again, I do think it's all sort of a risk to be vulnerable. And it's. It's not. It doesn't always mean it's gonna be successful. And success and value are different for me. And so it's something I say a lot when I'm talking to anyone that's like, working here or just even a partner of ours is just that people are really messy. And the goal that we have here is not to make people cleaner or arrive somewhere. It's just to look at it in a new light or just kind of explore it and engage with it. And I really don't know where there's other opportunities to do that outside of community spaces. And so how do we make sure these spaces continue to be available? How do we ensure that there's, like, public gathering spaces, that people can be honest and true to access it. And, yeah, I think about these things a lot. And so to be themselves here is a really high honor.

Sam Bauman: 37:10

Yeah, that's huge. I wanted to ask about the name of your studio, Curiosity Studio. I mean, that concept is something that is Very near and dear to me. And just tell me a little bit about what it means to your business.

Lauren Callis: 37:28

The meaning of it has very much evolved as time goes on. And perhaps where I find it kind of tongue in cheek when people say, like, oh, I'm just curious about it. Nice, that's the goal. And they, you know, get more curious as time goes on, I think. And the. The lack of, you know, sort of art studio language that accompanies it, you know, I think you can get the gist pretty quickly, but it is vague enough that it allows people to be curious on any level that they find curiosity. Sometimes when we're tabling, it's not even of interest to make art. It's just fun to someone. And that's one of our missions. And so, of course, that's going to be lovely for me. And let's engage. So I think the meaning of this curiosity studio has allowed there to be all these little rabbit holes too. We, I think, have just like made many iterations of the model over the years. And I think we're in this other iteration as well. We speak. That's sort of emerging. What is something that's just right now a curiosity. Not for all of time, not for not going forward, but just right now, this is coming up a lot or right now people are experiencing this specific condition that is allowing them to be curious about something in a new way. And so it allows the present moment to be pretty loud and clear if. If it needs to be. And I like that about it too. It's not. Yeah, yeah.

Sam Bauman: 39:04

I like what's written on your website too. There's like curiosity about yourself, others and the materials. I love that lens of just thinking. About the process of doing art.

Lauren Callis: 39:15

Yeah. And these like concentric or these widening circles that allow you to dig a little deeper, whether it's with yourself or with someone else. And that takes shape as time goes on. And I love considering the material intelligence of something. I love thinking about how your individual and innate interests in perhaps audio recording material, you're going to be easier and easier as time goes on. And I would say that we're very confident making here. Like we make confidence for people to feel comfortable trying something again. And maybe there's a little bit of a difference that they can make within that, you know, how they're using a tool or something. But for the most part, I'D say we're also reminding people that this is a practice and all of these things are a practice. We're not master painters. We're not master whatever. We're people that are practicing artists in these mediums or in these materials. And perhaps that invitation to slow down their expectations and be more patient with themselves as well.

Sam Bauman: 40:35

Yeah. So you've said that you're not a business owner, you're an artist and a key holder, but I'm still curious to hear you share some advice that you might have for other small business owners or people thinking about starting a small business.

Lauren Callis: 40:58

I don't know if I believe in advice. So my encouragement to really consider what they feel the most excited about all the time. Time. And then what they don't feel the most excited about ever, and what completely drains them. And, you know, we. If I could go back in time and start this business again, I'd obviously do it a million different ways than I did. And so that patience also is, I think, a huge piece of any business owner's puzzle. Like, how do you be patient with yourself and constantly remind yourself that you didn't need to know this. This before now, and now you do need to know it so you'll learn about it? And that is an endless spiral for me of like, why didn't I know this? And it's like, because you've never owned a business at this moment in this, you know, so Grace is a very huge part of owning a business. And so, yeah, I really. I really encourage people to think about the parts they don't like and find a way that they can have someone else do that or a way that can be achieved through a program or another piece of software. Or, you know, check out what your local community's small business office has for. You know, we have a bunch of services in Hennepin county that I didn't know about until way later. And I was like, well, that would have been cool. So all of these things might be available, but if you follow those curiosities a little bit, you might, you know, learn what's not in your responsibilities as much as possible.

Adam Rondeau: 42:33

When you started this studio, you did you already go into it thinking of yourself as more of a key holder or.

Lauren Callis: 42:42

I don't know if I thought it, but I think I was available to it. I was curious what this would do, like, how it would be received by people. My. My hunch was that people really just Wanted a place to make art and they maybe didn't need programming or they didn't want prompts. You know, as a person that's very comfortable making art, I would love a space to it. Right?

Adam Rondeau: 43:09

Yeah.

Lauren Callis: 43:09

So my suspicion was that maybe others would feel that way. And then when we first started with our open studio model, people were like, no, I would really love a prompt. I would really love to know what I should consider. And I've had to explore. But perhaps the part that I found most interesting is if I am. I mean, I think one of the things that I'm most interested in always evolving in is how do I offer this space for people to use it in the way that they see fit. And the tension of that being this consistency that people can expect when they come here. And so that's something I don't fully have answers to at any point in time. But I think is the dance that I try to engage with around this idea of key holder. And if I just put that hat on, does it help me think about a problem differently versus the business owner hat, which still just scares the daylights out of me. So if I shift that language, is it just a. A game that I'm able to play with myself? Great. Is it an invitation to come into the space differently? Great. It. I. I'm not sure if it would be any formalized like title, but I think as I've gone on, I've come across a lot of artists that also struggle with this title of business owner. Because any artist that's making art in their home and selling it, or making art and putting it in a gallery or any of these images, iterations of artists that we maybe have first and foremost, when we think of an art maker or an artist or whatever, I think all of them are business owners. And that is not a title that people want to actually lean into. And so what's the middle, like, what's the path that we can create in the middle of this tax filing artist versus a space where you can kind of make art and not have to have any income, you know, from that. And so I don't know, I like the tension of it. I like the tension of the idea of key holder versus business owner or encouraging to. Encouraging people to consider what is it that you want from this space? And can you make that happen or does it feel like you have permission for it? I don't know. I would have to ask participants if that feels possible for them.

Adam Rondeau: 45:31

But yeah, I think that it's just such an interesting place to start from because clearly there's a lot of intentionality in what you're doing. And sometimes, or it's really easy for a desire for control to be paired with intentionality. Right. It seems like the ways that you're balancing that are by thinking of control at like a more conceptual level. Like I see on the wall, the studio agreements, the. Those curiosity for yourself curiosity. So you're like providing a conceptual groundwork or the conceptual groundwork for what you want this place to be. And then you're comfortably stepping away and saying, okay, now let's see how that translates for the people that are coming into this space, whether they are employees or participants in these workshops. I just like when we talk to so many other businesses, it usually kind of goes the other way.

Sam Bauman: 46:24

Right.

Adam Rondeau: 46:24

They usually have to let go of some control. And I'm just, I guess, fascinated by, and appreciative that there are people out there like you who are starting from a place that is, I don't know, intentional, but also open.

Lauren Callis: 46:41

Yeah, I hope so. I mean, I think it's worth having conversations around. And that's, at the very least what I hope it achieves is how, you know, how do we create spaces that also require everyone? You know, I think I've been a part of enough like cooperative spaces or other environments that those. That container is already made. And so I hadn't been a part of something maybe from the jump that was requiring these decisions to be loose enough where as time went on, people could influence it. And then also there's still someone that has to hold the key and knows the metrics and knows the data that's coming in. And how does that land when we make decisions without the influence of others? And one of the things that we pretty intentionally did from the start was not be a nonprofit, because I think the ability to those that are a for profit business. But. But then if we're not in, I mean, we're not in business for profit, so how do we, you know, what is the alternative language there? You know, and there's, for me, there's not a satisfying alternative. But I'm not expecting the IRS to also like, provide me a nice word Language, you know, rabbit hole that I can fall into and find a comfort in. So I enjoy the tension of, you know, how does this look and does it respond to the participants? I don't know. We can, we can get their opinion on that. But we also have a leadership committee that has been supportive in, you know, if I have a concern that does require a little bit more of a decision maker, key holder type of decision, they can kind of bounce off that with me and say, yeah, this, I don't know, this seems odd, or this is maybe how I'd go about that. And this group can allow there to be accountability. And being raised in therapeutic world, I also seek like regular supervision with a person that I know intimately and has a lot of clinical considerations that are made to self elect certain decisions that are made about their own experience? Or how do we make sure people have a little more autonomy here or there and what are the things that you just have to make the decision, you know, And I don't think there's a right way that we've figured it out or I've figured it out yet. But that's something that I appreciate about the kind of key holder idea. And that language is something I've derived from a lot of artist led spaces because I think a lot of artists, as I said, feel very uncomfortable with this idea of being a business owner. And so. But artists also are the best problem solvers I know. And so how do we allow for language to kind of lead these alternative models as we consider spaces and third spaces?

Adam Rondeau: 49:41

Yeah, I mean, you're thinking about it as a conversation because that's just what it is. That's also what makes artists good at art, is they think of it as a conversation with themselves, the world and everything like that. So it makes sense that it comes naturally to you in that's how you would approach it. Not prescribing a recipe for success, but saying, let's see how the conversation goes and just react to that conversation.

Lauren Callis: 50:06

And I can't think of an example right now, but I know there's plenty of times where I'm like, oh, this just really needs someone to make a decision this moment. It's not really a community led decision, it's just someone needs to do the thing and that's part of it too. So I don't know, I'm just always really interested in how other people are considering the structures of their spaces. And I think it allows there to be. You know, I think one of my fears is sometimes that it creates a little bit more of anonymity than I'm intending. And there's no like, hiding. That's, you know, I really am generous with the royal we here. So I just want to it. It can be a we. And sometimes that might not feel like it aligns with people, but I just consider the. The model pretty extensively.

Adam Rondeau: 51:04

Yeah, you can tell. It's great. Oh, it really is.

Lauren Callis: 51:08

For better or for worse.

Sam Bauman: 51:10

So what business in the community would you like to spotlight today?

Lauren Callis: 51:17

Well, I'm excited about Z Puppets. They are on 43rd, 48th. I always get those two numbers confused. And Chicago and doing a big Glow in the Dark Cellular performance that's happening in October. And they are. Chris and Sherry are really lovely partners in this sort of what does business owning mean as artists? Conversation. And I appreciate their wisdom a whole heck of a lot. And so they have these performances coming up and they do all kinds of puppet making and, you know, interactive programming from this kind of artist LED lens. So I would spotlight them because they're doing some exciting things in the fall.

Sam Bauman: 52:03

Cool. Cool. That sounds awesome.

Adam Rondeau: 52:05

Yeah, it does sound great.

Sam Bauman: 52:07

Thank you so much for this conversation. It's been lovely and I love your colorful space. It's really fun to be in.

Lauren Callis: 52:14

Thanks. I appreciate the time.

Adam Rondeau: 52:16

Thank you.

Sam Bauman: 52:22

That was Lauren Callis of Curiosity Studio. If you want to check out the studio they're located on East Lake Street, right next to Laune Bread, a season one Not So Small guest. And if you haven't checked out that. Episode, you definitely should. You can also find Curiosity Studio online at curiositystudioclass.com or on Instagram curiositystudio_. If you're a business owner and you're looking for community focused, purpose driven and values based support.

Lauren Callis: 52:51

shit.

Sam Bauman: 52:52

If you're a business owner and you're looking for community focused, purpose driven, values based business support, consider sending Mellolark a message or checking out our website@mellolark.com we'd love to chat. Thank you so much for listening. Make sure to get updates of new episodes. Have a good.